Important, original bugs

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hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 08:55

Will OpenMW have bugs originally found in Morrowind?

For example, there is a bug in Morrowind with a calendar month or something missing.

The following are arguably bugs but are very important to retain, in my opinion, because they make enchanting a lot more fun. (There was a guy named SR71 who designed a ton of ingenious items that exploit some of these. It would be a shame if his designs were broken.)

1. You can mix Ash Yams and Bloats to make increasingly godly potions of intelligence

2. The effect Resist Paralysis is like 10x cheaper in terms of enchantment points than e.g. Resist Fire.

3. When you make a spell with a second, "on target" effect, then a previous "on touch / on self" effect will sometimes do extra damage or remain permanent. For example, you can summon a permanent monster or give yourself a permanent strength boost. Or, give the enemy an permanently increased weakness to magicka.

4. When you enchant an effect, say Constant Effect Fortify Strength 1-4 points, it will actually give you 1-3 points when you equip the item. But if you reverse the order, and make it Fortify Strength 4-1, then it will be 2-4.

5. Sometimes enchanting things in "stages" and exploiting bugs in the enchantment dialog is possible.

For example, this item exploits bugs 3, 4, and 5:

GodBreaker - Ebony Scimitar 80 EP
Incorporating the Target Effect, Reverse Variable Magnitudes, and 2 Stage Enchantment Process for Tempering & Special Effects


1st Stage
Cast When Used
Damage Health
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 5 to 5
Duration: 2
Area: 0
+
Weakness to Magicka
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 100 to 100
Duration: 2
Area: 0
+
Drain Fatigue
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 100 to 100
Duration: 2
Area: 0
+
Drain Health
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 100 to 100
Duration: 2
Area: 0

Attempt to finalize the enchantment, and you will receive a warning window/message. Now, reset the enchantment to the following:

2nd Stage
Cast When Strikes
Damage Health
Range: Target
Magnitude: 5 to 3 *
Duration: 1
Area: 1
+
Weakness to Magicka
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 100 to 100
Duration: 1
Area: 1
+
Drain Fatigue
Range: Touch
Magnitude: 100 to 100
Duration: 1
Area: 1

hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 08:59


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raevol
Posts: 3088
Joined: 07 Aug 2011, 01:12
Location: Caldera

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by raevol » 13 Mar 2014, 09:17

I feel like the things here that are mechanics that were just poorly thought out, like the intelligence potions, should be kept. But the things that are obviously bugs, like the missing calendar month or accidentally permanent spell effects, should be fixed.

Chris
Posts: 1583
Joined: 04 Sep 2011, 08:33

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by Chris » 13 Mar 2014, 13:13

IIRC, we've already fixed the missing month. For the Resist Paralysis cost, that's something specified in the game data so it's not something we deal with... however, there are unofficial patches that fix it (depending on who you talk to, though, it's not something that should be fixed).

hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 15:55

>however, there are unofficial patches that fix [Resist Paralysis Cost]
Yes, I edited mine to NOT fix it :)

>things that are obviously bugs, like the missing calendar month or accidentally permanent spell effects, should be fixed.

Fixing the latter would makes the game less fun. It is tremendously fun to exploit. For example, you can permanently charm Vivec and make him follow you around.

There is actually a bug in the original Morrowind where Sharn gra-Muzgob can fall through the world. I made a gauntlet to permanently boost my speed to ridiculous levels to levitate through the floor which allowed me to see her under the world. Of course, I made another gauntlet to undo the "permanent" changes.

There are other quest-related problems that can be worked around using permanent spells.

I'm sure I'm in a minority of players, but please don't take away my exploits :)

These are also useful exploits:

6. "A different way to recharge Magicka is with Drain Intelligence 100 for 1 second on self " http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Cheats

7. "Training in Morrowind has two major problems. The first is cost, and the other is the scant availability of high-level trainers. A simple way to work around this is to use a Drain Skill spell. This allows a normally high leveled skill to be trained by a cheaper low level trainer.

Even after reaching level 100 in a skill, you can continue raising it using this method. Also, your level keeps increasing as your skills do, so you continue to level up even after all your major and minor skills are at 100."
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Cheats
Last edited by hbrickface on 13 Mar 2014, 16:05, edited 1 time in total.

hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 16:03

This is also important to support, I think. From http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/3222/t2 ... item-code/

Weapon and Armor Duplication Trick

1. Enchant an extravagant ring (or amulet) with: constant effect - any bound armor spell & any bound armor spell & any bound weapon spell (or bound shield), in that order. Make sure that the weapon/armor items to be duplicated correspond to the bound spells enchanted on the ring, and that these items have full condition points.
2. Equip the weapon and armor you want duplicated, and then the enchanted extravagant ring.
3. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu, and un-equip the ring.
4. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu, and re-equip the ring.
5. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu, and un-equip the ring.
6. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu, and re-equip the ring.
7. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu (you should have 2 of the weapon and armor), and un-equip the ring, and re-equip the ring.
8. Exit and quickly re-enter the menu (you should have 3 of the weapon and armor), and un-equip the ring, and re-equip the ring.
9. And, so on.

Arrow duplication trick - from http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/3222/t192310-cheats/
"Equip your daedric arrows. Draw back the bow string, go into your menu, and then equip your iron or corkbulb arrows† if your really cheap.3-Exit the menu. Now, you should notice you still have the daedric arrow drawn back, but in the menu, you have the lesser value arrow equipped. Keep the bow drawn, and fire at a guard. 4-Now repeat this trick, by equipping and replacing with cheaper arrows, several times, until the guard is dead. You will have lost no daedric arrows, but you will have lost the other kind. 5-Now, go up to the guard's body, and check. Some of the arrows will be in his body, but they are DAEDRIC arrows"

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raevol
Posts: 3088
Joined: 07 Aug 2011, 01:12
Location: Caldera

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by raevol » 13 Mar 2014, 18:18

I dunno. Not a big fan of exploits that are just a result of poor code. I'm all for exploits of poor mechanics, but not poor code.

hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 19:05

Yeah, I knew people would disagree with me.

Sadly, I won't play OpenMW if it isn't faithful in these aspects, because it will be less fun.
I might have to make my own C++ patch so I can play it :)

The calendar bug is a silly bug I don't care about, but I thought I'd just mention as an example.
And there are certainly bugs I don't want, for example crash bugs. IIRC you can crash the game if you kill a summoned monster and then dispose of it while the corpse is in the process of falling.
Last edited by hbrickface on 13 Mar 2014, 19:08, edited 1 time in total.

Chris
Posts: 1583
Joined: 04 Sep 2011, 08:33

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by Chris » 13 Mar 2014, 19:08

Yeah, I'm not a fan of purposely coding in exploits that are a result of poor coding/design. They're indicative of bugs that could inhibit future improvements. If you really want to cheat and exploit, you always have the console and mods to get what you want.

hbrickface
Posts: 9
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 08:35

Re: Important, original bugs

Post by hbrickface » 13 Mar 2014, 19:14

Chris wrote:I'm not a fan of purposely coding in exploits that are a result of poor coding/design.
I don't agree with your viewpoint at all.

Some bugs can add a lot of charm to the game. There have been entire websites devoted to exploiting game bugs.

For example, people are still working on exploiting bugs in this very old game: "Sept 3 2012

Congratulations to Jackobones From the Brazilian Forums. He has figured out a way to get a cave troll stuck in the inverted castle left lake and has been able to use this troll to open 11 new Rooms using the "Mist Up" Technique. This brings the Maps to 406.1% Non S4R and 426.7% with S4R" - http://www.execulink.com/~maggi/wbw/

IMHO OpenMW should bring an authentic morrowind experience, not just please programmers with pretty code.

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