Darknut's Dwemer House

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Jemolk
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Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by Jemolk » 30 Nov 2018, 19:31

Darknut said it didn't work with OpenMW. Well, I tested it, because I really wanted it, and it works! There's one exception, the mannequins in one spot are too close to the wall and the collision geometry bugs out in OpenMW, so I made a patch for that. Actually, thinking on it, the fish in the fish tank also have an annoying tendency to physics-bug out and emerge through its top, but this interferes with gameplay much less, so I left it alone. Entirely dependent on Darknut's files, of course. It also fixes the issue where the first journal entry of the mod accidentally has the "name" flag set.

There *may* be another exception. The mod description mentions a new teleport system, which I can't find even in the OpenMW CS. I may be misinterpreting something here, though.
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psi29a
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by psi29a » 30 Nov 2018, 20:56

Great work and thanks for testing!

1) You should relay to Darknut that it does, mostly, work with OpenMW
2) What is the patch?
3) Is there an issue filed on our tracker?
4) If not, could you create one? Vanilla mods should "just work" provide doesn't take advantage of any flaws/bugs in the original engine.

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wareya
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by wareya » 01 Dec 2018, 17:09

The collision issue is a bug in the original engine, where the actors aren't colliding with the wall that they're already overlapping.
paying attention to #1751 #2473 #3609 #3862/#3929 #3807 #4297 #4623

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Jemolk
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by Jemolk » 02 Dec 2018, 08:15

psi29a wrote:
30 Nov 2018, 20:56
Great work and thanks for testing!

1) You should relay to Darknut does it does, mostly, work with OpenMW
2) What is the patch?
3) Is there an issue filed on our tracker?
4) If not, could you create one? Vanilla mods should "just work" provide doesn't take advantage of any flaws/bugs in the original engine.
1. I did post on the mod page on Nexus as well.
2. Deals with jittery mannquins that were too close to the wall in OpenMW. It's the "actors moving inside collision boxes" thing. Fixing that would also probably fix sitting NPCs. Fixed here by simply moving them away from the wall a bit. The collision issue is an OpenMW hazard, if not bug, where when collision boxes overlap, things move erratically up and down. It's most obvious with mannequins. Try loading Darknut's house mod unchanged and go to the upstairs area of the living quarters to see what I mean. The cell name is Kazara, Living Quarters.
3-4. Pretty sure the jittery mannequins bug is already there. No, no it's not. Okay, on it. EDIT: Done!
wareya wrote:
01 Dec 2018, 17:09
The collision issue is a bug in the original engine, where the actors aren't colliding with the wall that they're already overlapping.
Yeah, the vanilla engine doesn't have things bouncing up and down erratically whenever collision boxes overlap. I think I rather like that feature. I think it's a rather good feature. A definite improvement over what we've got right now.

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psi29a
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by psi29a » 02 Dec 2018, 09:55

Looks like a duplicate of https://gitlab.com/OpenMW/openmw/issues/4465 (why it was closed)

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Jemolk
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by Jemolk » 03 Dec 2018, 23:18

psi29a wrote:
02 Dec 2018, 09:55
Looks like a duplicate of https://gitlab.com/OpenMW/openmw/issues/4465 (why it was closed)
I swear I searched for that. Damn.

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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by psi29a » 04 Dec 2018, 09:08

No worries! :)

Thanks for taking the time to review this mod.

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wareya
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by wareya » 07 Dec 2018, 20:08

Jemolk wrote:
02 Dec 2018, 08:15
Yeah, the vanilla engine doesn't have things bouncing up and down erratically whenever collision boxes overlap. I think I rather like that feature. I think it's a rather good feature. A definite improvement over what we've got right now.
The reason they bounce is because of the scripts attached to them controlling their position, if it weren't for them they would just slide outside of the wall and stop moving. Bouncing is a problem, but every element here is buggy in some way, OpenMW, Vanilla Morrowind, and also the mod. OpenMw should handle it better, but there's no reason it should handle it like vanilla, because vanilla's behavior is extremely broken.
paying attention to #1751 #2473 #3609 #3862/#3929 #3807 #4297 #4623

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Jemolk
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by Jemolk » 09 Dec 2018, 00:13

wareya wrote:
07 Dec 2018, 20:08
Jemolk wrote:
02 Dec 2018, 08:15
Yeah, the vanilla engine doesn't have things bouncing up and down erratically whenever collision boxes overlap. I think I rather like that feature. I think it's a rather good feature. A definite improvement over what we've got right now.
The reason they bounce is because of the scripts attached to them controlling their position, if it weren't for them they would just slide outside of the wall and stop moving. Bouncing is a problem, but every element here is buggy in some way, OpenMW, Vanilla Morrowind, and also the mod. OpenMw should handle it better, but there's no reason it should handle it like vanilla, because vanilla's behavior is extremely broken.
How is vanilla behavior broken? It behaves exactly as you'd expect and desire for mannequins 99.999% of the time. Beyond which, maybe sometimes you want actors being embedded in the meshes of other things without having to specifically edit one or the other to have no collision mesh. Sitting NPCs are the additional obvious example here, or maybe you want an NPC to be buried in the ground up to their neck for some story reason. Vanilla behavior will let you do exactly that. It seems the way vanilla works is only enforce collision box overlap when actual movement is involved. That should resolve all our issues, no?

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wareya
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Re: Darknut's Dwemer House

Post by wareya » 10 Dec 2018, 23:11

Vanilla lets actors pass through geometry that they're already overlapping. That's broken. It's not even up for debate whether it's broken or not.

The mannequins are also in the air (or, to be more precise, they're on a "steep slope" instead of a "floor", because they're overlapping the wall), which makes gravity apply to them, which means that they try to move.

It IS desirable to have actors not pop out of things that they're overlapping, but once they start moving, popping them out is the only thing you can do without being broken.

I tried a few ways of switching between popping-out and staying-still to fix the mannequins without affecting anything else, but they all caused other problems.
paying attention to #1751 #2473 #3609 #3862/#3929 #3807 #4297 #4623

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