Dialogue thread, error-checking

Moderator: Example suite forum moderator

User avatar
DestinedToDie
Posts: 1056
Joined: 29 Jun 2015, 09:08

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by DestinedToDie » 05 Sep 2017, 23:27

Vello Tamre (previously known as Heino Tamre) related journal indexes.

If you accept a drink:
I accepted a drink from Vello Tamre. He seemed a bit more relaxed after that.

If you decline:
I declined Vello Tamre's offer for a drink. He appeared slightly disappointed by this.

Greeting from Vello Tamre afterwards:

I try to warn them when they come. Not everyone listens...

Arno Hein on Hay Sack:

Nice place, isn't it? You need to amass quite a bit of wealth if you want to settle down and open your own place, so not many merchants can afford their own residence. I happened to close a special deal after I heard that Lord Markus regarding my establishment. I was to provide a bunch of cheap hay for construction material and he'd have this inn built and written in my name. The village might only be in its beginning stages, but in a few years it´ll be a bustling town with plenty of clients, he said. Sometimes I feel he got more out of the agreement than I did.

Arno Hein on Graveyard:

It's just behind the church, easy to find. Hard part is getting in now that there's a lock on the gate.

User avatar
Thunderforge
Posts: 154
Joined: 06 Jun 2017, 05:57
Github profile: https://github.com/Thunderforge

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by Thunderforge » 08 Sep 2017, 19:23

DestinedToDie wrote:
05 Sep 2017, 08:50
About the God thing. My intention is to have a singular God as in my vision this is a place where people know and have only heard of one God. As to which God it is, I didn't have any plans on elaborating, leaving it open for the imagination of the players. Though God plays an integral part in the short main quest I'm writing, it's more of a plot twist than a focus.
If you're okay with the player potentially linking this God with the Abrahamic God of our world (as I did when I first read the description), then you should be fine. But if not, you might consider changing it to some other term. A number of other works that want to convey a singular deity, but not have this link, tend to use alternative titles, like "Goddess", "The Maker", "The Creator", etc. (See TV Tropes' Crystal Dragon Jesus page for more examples).
DestinedToDie wrote:
05 Sep 2017, 08:50
The setting is Lovecraftian, with the Necronomicon and all. A medieval type of Lovecraftian. The almost black and white colors of the textures is a subtle give-away if you've watched movies like Whisperer in the Darkness. It's part of why I've been a little bit reluctant to change them despite people telling me I should colorize... maybe they'll grow to like the atmosphere it gives as the project matures into a more developed state and they can see where I'm going with this?
Sounds neat. Kind of taking the Sixth House creepiness in Morrowind and focusing on that. You might find the 2015 movie The Witch to be a good inspiration for the tone you are going for. It doesn't take place in the medieval era, but it is a period piece (Puritan era) exploring these sorts of dark themes. Although I'll warn you that most people say the film is more enjoyable the less you know about it going in.
DestinedToDie wrote:
05 Sep 2017, 23:27
Arno Hein on Hay Sack:

Nice place, isn't it? You need to amass quite a bit of wealth if you want to settle down and open your own place, so not many merchants can afford their own establishment. I happened to disclose a special deal after I heard that Lord Markus was looking for some cheap building material and someone who'd be willing to start running a permanent business in a village that was still in its beginning stages. Sometimes I feel he got more out of the agreement than I did.
The third sentence seems pretty convoluted. Also, should it be "close a special deal" instead of "disclose a special deal"? The former means that he completed the deal, the latter means that he revealed the deal when it was supposed to be a secret. Perhaps rephrase to "I got my place with the help of Lord Markus. He wanted someone to start running a permanent business in this village when it was getting started, and he provided me with some cheap building material. Sometimes I feel he got more out of the agreement than I did."

If my revision doesn't capture your intended meaning, then it's probably a sign that the current version isn't quite working ;)
DestinedToDie wrote:
05 Sep 2017, 23:27
Arno Hein on Graveyard:

It's just behind the church, easy to find. Hard part is getting rid of the lock on the gate.
Huh, weird that he assumes that I'm wanting to break in to the graveyard. Also makes me wonder what mourners do. Do they just leave flowers at the gate? I dunno, can the OpenMW engine treat the graveyard like a shop, where it kicks you out after a certain amount of time and then locks it, with a puzzle being that you need to get in after dark?

User avatar
DestinedToDie
Posts: 1056
Joined: 29 Jun 2015, 09:08

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by DestinedToDie » 08 Sep 2017, 23:58

Edited the graveyard and Hay Sack dialogue to make more sense. I never expected that people might interpret things in ways I didn't intend.

I suppose I might as well explain why the graveyard is locked as well as some other thoughts I've had of the potential lore and backstory.

A few centuries ago, mankind rebelled against God. In this rebellion, they resorted to the use of otherworldly means. With the use of their newly gained power, it seemed like even God could be killed. In the darkest hour, however, fear rose among those who had engorged themselves with secrets better left untouched. They began to see visions, visions of the future that would come, the deep and the one who had deceived them. In desperation, those who had not yet fallen ripped their memories out (in the form of brain matter) and used skin and flesh that had come off in the process to cover up the visions of The Elder God. The result of this is what has come to be known as the Necronomicon.

It is hard to tell if the God of man was slayed that day, for the event was eclipsed by the price payed for dabbling in the dark arts. Perhaps he is dead indeed, or he might be wounded and recovering, or perhaps he simply left us that day. What is apparent is that ever since then, the land has turned grey and the people stagnant. A world with no God that slowly loses color and withers away.

Father Reinold. He searches for God. And his searches bring him to the postapocalyptic Deadwood where the struggle between God and man first happened. The graves of fallen men are his guide, for they are the only mention of God's appearance after the unholy war. But moreso than of God, the gravestones speak of another being, one who sounds suitable to Father Reinold to fill that position.

In his search, Father Reinold reaches a seemingly insignificant fort at Whiteford. But the gravestones indicate differently. This is the very epicenter where it all happened. Whiteford is guarded, a stranger coming from the woods does not easily go unnoticed by the few villagers and the men at their posts. Instead of trying to sneak in, he starts speaking of God to the villagers, and his soon return.

The church of Whiteford becomes his home, where he preaches to his congregation. And the cemetary his holy grounds, where only those proven to be true believers can further learn of God. And that is my roundabout way of explaining why the graveyard gate is locked for you. You want to mourn for a dead one? Well you better be a true believer in Reinold's eyes.

If player thinks that God is the Abrahamic God, then that's fine with me. I'm leaving it really open in case we want to do something with the God of man later down the line. Btw. While I have watched some Lovecraft movies, played a Lovecraft game and even listened to a few short audiobooks, I don't really have a firm grasp on what Lovecraft is. As such, I'm not writing an adaptation, but rather my own interpretation of what Lovecraft might be without knowing what it really is. I do this in hope that we get something unique rather than just another Cthulhu game.

User avatar
Thunderforge
Posts: 154
Joined: 06 Jun 2017, 05:57
Github profile: https://github.com/Thunderforge

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by Thunderforge » 10 Sep 2017, 01:42

DestinedToDie wrote:
08 Sep 2017, 23:58
Edited the graveyard and Hay Sack dialogue to make more sense. I never expected that people might interpret things in ways I didn't intend.
As any tabletop RPG GM knows, players will always find ways to go off the rails of your perfectly crafted story! Anticipate the best you can, but getting feedback from others who don't know your intentions is even better!
DestinedToDie wrote:
08 Sep 2017, 23:58
If player thinks that God is the Abrahamic God, then that's fine with me.
Okay, just wanted to make sure you were okay with the player possibly making that link. Some authors are very particular about making their readers have a certain impression, rather than chasing red herrings that were never intended :)

User avatar
raevol
Posts: 2454
Joined: 07 Aug 2011, 01:12
Location: Caldera

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by raevol » 10 Sep 2017, 03:53

Thunderforge wrote:
10 Sep 2017, 01:42
As any tabletop RPG GM knows, players will always find ways to go off the rails of your perfectly crafted story! Anticipate the best you can, but getting feedback from others who don't know your intentions is even better!
Basically you want the quest to make sense even if the player does it completely ass backwards. You anticipate they go from quest giver to objective, but what if they start at the objective?

User avatar
Thunderforge
Posts: 154
Joined: 06 Jun 2017, 05:57
Github profile: https://github.com/Thunderforge

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by Thunderforge » 10 Sep 2017, 05:57

raevol wrote:
10 Sep 2017, 03:53
Basically you want the quest to make sense even if the player does it completely ass backwards. You anticipate they go from quest giver to objective, but what if they start at the objective?
Excellent point! Also, what if they already killed the target, etc. The Morag Tong questline made sure to provide for that possibility. "It's not healthy to anticipate the Morag Tong". Oh, and what if they found the object before getting the quest, dropped it in the middle of nowhere, and how has no idea where it is. One YouTube reviewer ran into that problem with Ultima VII: Part 2 and couldn't complete the game.

Probably my favorite example regarding the developers considering all the backwards possibilities is Sheogorath's shrine quest in Oblivion. If you have the Shivering Isles expansion installed (which involves Sheogorath), there are eight different opening dialogues (all fully voiced) depending on which other quests you have completed, most of them pointing out that you really have far more important things you're supposed to be doing than this trivial task.
You would summon me? Wait... why are YOU summoning me? You've got things to do. Things I told you to do. This makes me frown.

User avatar
raevol
Posts: 2454
Joined: 07 Aug 2011, 01:12
Location: Caldera

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by raevol » 10 Sep 2017, 06:12

Nice, yep!

User avatar
DestinedToDie
Posts: 1056
Joined: 29 Jun 2015, 09:08

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by DestinedToDie » 10 Sep 2017, 09:05

Oh, definitely. I´ve played through all of Morrowind´s quests and am aware of ways how quests are handled. Considering the non-linearity the OpenMW engine allows, analogous implementation in that area is pretty much a given. If you are a thief, you can get early access to the graveyard by lockpicking it to do some graverobbing, but plot device won't show up in there until the quest has progressed to a certain point. I also considered making it possible to climb, but then it feels like it devalues the thief classes who go through the trouble of getting a lockpick.

I also thought about good ending where you figure out who has the Necronomicon before it's spelled out ingame and retrieve it, effectively ending the questline early and rather un-eventfully.

User avatar
DestinedToDie
Posts: 1056
Joined: 29 Jun 2015, 09:08

Re: Dialogue thread, error-checking

Post by DestinedToDie » 16 Sep 2017, 12:23

Madis Visnapuu greeting when first meet:

Hello, stranger. Do you live under the rule of a king, as the rest of us?

Yes.
Though the king may have rule of us all, the kingdom of man resides in the domain of God. It is by his endowment that we have been granted dominion for the time of his absence. As such, it is important to govern ourselves with restraint and modesty, lest we wish to feel ashamed of our deeds on the day of his return.
No.
Those who speak openly of their lack of allegiance are often seen as renegades and disruptors to the kingdom of man. However I will not judge you as such. After all, no mere man should be bowed down to, only God is worthy of our devotion. If you do not yet know God, visit the church behind the trees. There you will find guidance.

Madis Visnapuu greeting afterwards:

The kingdom of man is transient, God is eternal.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 0 guests