Project not complete without normal maps.

Not about OpenMW? Just about Morrowind in general? Have some random babble? Kindly direct it here.
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jermungand
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Project not complete without normal maps.

Post by jermungand » 09 Jun 2016, 04:30

I'll be happy when there are normal maps for every texture. It doesn't look like it will be done anytime soon, and I'll be more than content to accept this project as complete when it finally crosses that line.

The idea of developing the newest of modern gaming's graphical features in an engine made to run Morrowind's assets, however, strikes me like the idea of a cafeteria sandwich-maker putting foie gras and sauteed truffles on a frozen whitebread BLT. Everything in the game would have to be remade from scratch before that parallax occlusion effect made a difference in the graphics' overall visual grade.

At that point, I'm lead to wonder why I wouldn't simply wait for Skywind. Of course it wouldn't be Morrowind exactly, but this is why movies get high-tech remakes as well as digitally remastered editions of the original. Each serves a different, and much valued purpose, but neither can reasonably claim to meet both (nor should they).

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lysol
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by lysol » 09 Jun 2016, 07:36

You do know that OpenMW is a game engine and not a morrowind mod right? So even though you might think of this as a waste of time, maybe those planning to make a game with this engine does not think so.

But you go ahead and wait for Skywind. No ones trying to prevent you. :)
Normal mapped texture replacers, exclusive for OpenMW:
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psi29a
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by psi29a » 09 Jun 2016, 10:00

jermungand wrote:I'll be happy when there are normal maps for every texture. It doesn't look like it will be done anytime soon, and I'll be more than content to accept this project as complete when it finally crosses that line.
What you are asking for is something that OpenMW's dev team cannot help you with. We do not make content for Morrowind, we make a game engine that can play Morrowind.

Is it safe to assume that until a modder replaces all textures for Morrowind, then you won't consider OpenMW complete?

How does that even work logically? Repeat after me: OpenMW does not make content for Morrowind.

What you could do is ask the talented people of skywind to port their assets to work with vanilla morrowind. That would solve your problem because you can then play Morrowind with normal maps on OpenMW.

jermungand
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by jermungand » 09 Jun 2016, 16:00

psi29a wrote:
jermungand wrote:I'll be happy when there are normal maps for every texture. It doesn't look like it will be done anytime soon, and I'll be more than content to accept this project as complete when it finally crosses that line.
What you are asking for is something that OpenMW's dev team cannot help you with. We do not make content for Morrowind, we make a game engine that can play Morrowind.

Is it safe to assume that until a modder replaces all textures for Morrowind, then you won't consider OpenMW complete?

How does that even work logically? Repeat after me: OpenMW does not make content for Morrowind.

What you could do is ask the talented people of skywind to port their assets to work with vanilla morrowind. That would solve your problem because you can then play Morrowind with normal maps on OpenMW.
:roll: Yes, I'm quite acutely aware of the fact that the OpenMW team writes the code, and that texture artists (separate modders) actually make the normal maps <sigh>.

Buddy, I'm just referring to the eventual point in time when I can play MW the way I would like to play it. That is all I was talking about. There's absolutely no point in even having a thread about the merits of occlusion on parallax maps in the first place, if we're not even going to bother treating the actual implementation of these sorts of things as a pertinent issue (exactly who is responsible for that implementation is entirely beside the point).

GeorgeTheWarp
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by GeorgeTheWarp » 10 Jun 2016, 02:23

jermungand wrote:
psi29a wrote:
jermungand wrote:I'll be happy when there are normal maps for every texture. It doesn't look like it will be done anytime soon, and I'll be more than content to accept this project as complete when it finally crosses that line.
What you are asking for is something that OpenMW's dev team cannot help you with. We do not make content for Morrowind, we make a game engine that can play Morrowind.

Is it safe to assume that until a modder replaces all textures for Morrowind, then you won't consider OpenMW complete?

How does that even work logically? Repeat after me: OpenMW does not make content for Morrowind.

What you could do is ask the talented people of skywind to port their assets to work with vanilla morrowind. That would solve your problem because you can then play Morrowind with normal maps on OpenMW.
:roll: Yes, I'm quite acutely aware of the fact that the OpenMW team writes the code, and that texture artists (separate modders) actually make the normal maps <sigh>.

Buddy, I'm just referring to the eventual point in time when I can play MW the way I would like to play it. That is all I was talking about. There's absolutely no point in even having a thread about the merits of occlusion on parallax maps in the first place, if we're not even going to bother treating the actual implementation of these sorts of things as a pertinent issue (exactly who is responsible for that implementation is entirely beside the point).
Then why don't you do it yourself then? You may whine about it not being done, but if you don't do anything to help, then the fault is on your side, not OpenMW team's. And if the game's not the way you'd want to play it, and you would like it to change, change it yourself. Don't wait for somebody else to do it, especially with a 15 years old game, because it most probably won't happen. OpenMW IMO is an engine before anything else, and a quality one at that.

Short thing short: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXsQAXx_ao0

jermungand
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by jermungand » 12 Jun 2016, 16:18

GeorgeTheWarp wrote:
jermungand wrote:
psi29a wrote:
jermungand wrote:I'll be happy when there are normal maps for every texture. It doesn't look like it will be done anytime soon, and I'll be more than content to accept this project as complete when it finally crosses that line.
What you are asking for is something that OpenMW's dev team cannot help you with. We do not make content for Morrowind, we make a game engine that can play Morrowind.

Is it safe to assume that until a modder replaces all textures for Morrowind, then you won't consider OpenMW complete?

How does that even work logically? Repeat after me: OpenMW does not make content for Morrowind.

What you could do is ask the talented people of skywind to port their assets to work with vanilla morrowind. That would solve your problem because you can then play Morrowind with normal maps on OpenMW.
:roll: Yes, I'm quite acutely aware of the fact that the OpenMW team writes the code, and that texture artists (separate modders) actually make the normal maps <sigh>.

Buddy, I'm just referring to the eventual point in time when I can play MW the way I would like to play it. That is all I was talking about. There's absolutely no point in even having a thread about the merits of occlusion on parallax maps in the first place, if we're not even going to bother treating the actual implementation of these sorts of things as a pertinent issue (exactly who is responsible for that implementation is entirely beside the point).
Then why don't you do it yourself then? You may whine about it not being done, but if you don't do anything to help, then the fault is on your side, not OpenMW team's. And if the game's not the way you'd want to play it, and you would like it to change, change it yourself. Don't wait for somebody else to do it, especially with a 15 years old game, because it most probably won't happen. OpenMW IMO is an engine before anything else, and a quality one at that.

Short thing short: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXsQAXx_ao0
Could you please reference a point in this discussion where I whine about anything not being done?

I said that there's probably not much merit in including parallax occlusion, and that normals will be good enough.

Then, someone misunderstood me, because I'd been talking about OpenMW with regard to how it will be utilized, rather than only in regard to the engine by itself. They got a bit testy in fact, so I responded to them with (admittedly) some measure of exasperation.

Never at any point have I complained about the current progress of the normal maps. Nor have I ever stated that those maps were the OpenMW coders' job.

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Atahualpa
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Re: Parallax Occlusion : A possibility?

Post by Atahualpa » 12 Jun 2016, 20:24

@jermungand: Well, I guess some of your wording may have suggested a certain degree of dissatisfaction. But let's not start a war on that account. Please keep in mind that these forums are home to many different people drawn to OpenMW for very different reasons - and stating your opinion may result in some members feeling tread on their toes. In this case, it's everyone's responsibility to de-escalate. After all, we are not doing politics here.

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psi29a
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Re: Project not complete without normal maps.

Post by psi29a » 13 Jun 2016, 08:48

Splitting this off-topic discussion away from the original thread because it has no bearing on OP's technical topic.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3598

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