New Skywind trailer

Not about OpenMW? Just about Morrowind in general? Have some random babble? Kindly direct it here.
MacKom
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by MacKom » 19 Dec 2013, 23:34

Okulo wrote:
MacKom wrote:One thing I don`t understand is the "animosity" between Skywind and OMW team. I mean...why? Is it like a contest? "Who is going to make it better/sooner"? Seriously, guys... :roll:
Is there animosity, then? Aside from assuming people are thieves based on misunderstanding the word "liberation" in the context of an open-source project, of course.
I dare say - yes, there is. For instance, I remember a post on tumblr that pretty much said "lol f*** Skywind, that`s a piece of trash, wait for OMW". So...would that count as animosity?

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psi29a
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by psi29a » 19 Dec 2013, 23:48

I don't believe anyone who has contributed anything to OpenMW would be so brash and arrogant as to say anything like that. Then again.. we did step on toes once with a certain meme... but the TR guys came around in the end. :)

It is also highly unlikely to be anyone from the forums, but you seem to already be pointing the fingers and presuming guilt... that says more about you than it does about us. Let us know who it is so we can take 'em out back and baseball bat their knees. There is no point in pissing people off, we've better things to do with our time. Aside from wasting time, it is also bad PR. You just don't do it. I chalk it up to the "Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory".

I think everyone here thought Skywind to be awesome, otherwise it wouldn't have been posted here to begin with. Great work on their part.

Cheers! :)

MacKom
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by MacKom » 20 Dec 2013, 00:43

BrotherBrick wrote:I don't believe anyone who has contributed anything to OpenMW would be so brash and arrogant as to say anything like that. Then again.. we did step on toes once with a certain meme... but the TR guys came around in the end. :)

It is also highly unlikely to be anyone from the forums, but you seem to already be pointing the fingers and presuming guilt... that says more about you than it does about us. Let us know who it is so we can take 'em out back and baseball bat their knees. There is no point in pissing people off, we've better things to do with our time. Aside from wasting time, it is also bad PR. You just don't do it. I chalk it up to the "Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory".

I think everyone here thought Skywind to be awesome, otherwise it wouldn't have been posted here to begin with. Great work on their part.

Cheers! :)
While I can`t say I pointed my finger and presumed guilt, I can say I simply stated what I saw/read. And that`s it.

Long story short - I believe it would be best for both mod parties to keep to each other. At least for now. Tensions get high quickly, and for no benefit what so ever.
Also, as for resource sharing - why? Why would anyone want to take parts of one mod and put it into another? I believe both mods have a capable "fanbase". If need be, once OMW is out, I`m sure someone will find the time to make new assets, creatures, etc...we just need OMW to enable this.

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taknamay
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by taknamay » 20 Dec 2013, 02:37

They are two completely different things. Skywind is a mod, OpenMW is an engine... obviously they could complement each other, but why would they compete?

Tolchock
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by Tolchock » 20 Dec 2013, 04:28

Yeah, the two projects are coming from entirely different angles. OpenMW has functioning assets, but an incomplete engine, Skywind has a working engine but assets that don't function yet.

There really are excellent opportunities for collaboration here -- for example, one of the artists creating new assets for Skywind could release their own mod, a replacer for OpenMW -- it could be entirely credited to them, and completely separate from the OpenMW project itself. A developer from Skywind posted in this forum earlier, and was excited about these kind of opportunities -- apart from this one misunderstanding, I don't think there has been any hostility around here (and certainly not from the people on the OpenMW forums).

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psi29a
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by psi29a » 20 Dec 2013, 08:57

MacKom wrote:While I can`t say I pointed my finger and presumed guilt, I can say I simply stated what I saw/read. And that`s it.

Long story short - I believe it would be best for both mod parties to keep to each other. At least for now. Tensions get high quickly, and for no benefit what so ever.
Also, as for resource sharing - why? Why would anyone want to take parts of one mod and put it into another? I believe both mods have a capable "fanbase". If need be, once OMW is out, I`m sure someone will find the time to make new assets, creatures, etc...we just need OMW to enable this.
You took what someone said somewhere else and then lumped OpenMW community to them and called it animosity... when it is most definitely not. I know it is hard to admit being wrong on the Internet, but at least understand that no one here wishes ill of Skywind. We encourage all modders.

As otherwise stated, OpenMW is an engine that uses Morrowind assets and their mods. Skywind is a mod that recreates the Morrowind world in Skyrim. The two are not the same, and we have different goals. No one here gives a rats ass about competition. There are already projects like Aedra and Crystal Scrolls, so what is one more?

What some of us was interested in was the work that went in to Skywind, such as the textures, if they could be used, as a mod, in OpenMW. We, OpenMW, do not ship/release mods, just the engine. Think about it, we are mostly engineers, not artists. What projects like TR and Skywind are doing are pretty awesome. :)

MacKom
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by MacKom » 20 Dec 2013, 13:07

BrotherBrick wrote: You took what someone said somewhere else and then lumped OpenMW community to them and called it animosity... when it is most definitely not. I know it is hard to admit being wrong on the Internet, but at least understand that no one here wishes ill of Skywind. We encourage all modders.
Oh well, it won`t be the first time something I said was interpreted the wrong way.
All right, I was wrong.

Now, as for textures, again - why? Why would you want to do that? You would have to either have a) exactly the same meshes for those textures or b) do some major tweaking to fit them to meshes Morrowind is using. It would be easier to create new ones.

And as for the "art" side of the whole project - it is very difficult for folks like me (who are "artistic") to start making new things simply b/c we don`t know if they will be supported. I could go on and create new body meshes (sculpting, retopo, UVing, baking) or a new set of heads with included morphs and sliders as .tri files, but - I have no idea if that will be supported. There is still that "post 1.0" thing, and as a modder, I just don`t know what to expect or rely on in further mod making. THAT`S the catch.

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WeirdSexy
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by WeirdSexy » 20 Dec 2013, 13:52

MacKom wrote:Now, as for textures, again - why? Why would you want to do that? You would have to either have a) exactly the same meshes for those textures or b) do some major tweaking to fit them to meshes Morrowind is using. It would be easier to create new ones.
He said "such as textures". He means any or all of the assets from Skywind. So yes, the first option: using exactly the same meshes.

My question is: how 1:1 are the dimensions of Skywind meshes with vanilla Morrowind meshes? I think some people are imagining a sort of "drop in" process for using Skywind assets, if they were converted. I'm not sure we can assume that would be a smooth process.

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psi29a
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by psi29a » 20 Dec 2013, 14:45

MacKom wrote:And as for the "art" side of the whole project - it is very difficult for folks like me (who are "artistic") to start making new things simply b/c we don`t know if they will be supported. I could go on and create new body meshes (sculpting, retopo, UVing, baking) or a new set of heads with included morphs and sliders as .tri files, but - I have no idea if that will be supported. There is still that "post 1.0" thing, and as a modder, I just don`t know what to expect or rely on in further mod making. THAT`S the catch.
That is a big catch indeed, I understand where you are coming from. While there is the mantra of getting to 1.0 as soon as possible, there is always a dev or two that add extras that make a world of difference. I take it you have seen some of the nice work that done by scrawl to allow for bumpmaps and other shiny things.

As for formats, anything that Ogre3D can support, we can also support. It needn't be exclusively NIF.

What I honestly think that would make the difference is if modders would ask or better yet, file bugs for each format or technique that would like to see supported in OpenMW. This would give developers an idea of where to go 'next'. Right now, we're just adding things to get us to 1.0 and a few 'cool' things along the way.

What would help you and/or Skywind?

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Okulo
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Re: New Skywind trailer

Post by Okulo » 20 Dec 2013, 14:47

MacKom wrote:I dare say - yes, there is. For instance, I remember a post on tumblr that pretty much said "lol f*** Skywind, that`s a piece of trash, wait for OMW". So...would that count as animosity?
Was that someone from the OpenMW team? Because if not, then no, it would not count as animosity between the Skywind and OpenMW team. :P
BrotherBrick wrote:I don't believe anyone who has contributed anything to OpenMW would be so brash and arrogant as to say anything like that. Then again.. we did step on toes once with a certain meme... but the TR guys came around in the end. :)
Oooh, that sounds like some interesting drama. What's the story behind that?
MacKom wrote:Also, as for resource sharing - why? Why would anyone want to take parts of one mod and put it into another?
Why not? After all, why do the work twice when the work can be done only once?

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