Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

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xander2077
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Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 04 Feb 2016, 18:35

Okulo wrote:An "add folder" button would do little to solve that, since you could easily move around or rename the folder afterwards, which means you'd still be managing your folders manually. Besides, if you're a semi-intelligent user, you have been copypasting the lines into the config file from the file manager anyway instead of typing the entry out. The way to solve this what Antsan said: add a check as the config file is read.
been there done that, still wont stay in the file
Ravenwing wrote:@xander2077 I'm not at my desktop where I have everything installed so I can't be sure, but is there a separate config file located in your user documents? (I'm guessing it's similar on linux) I had a heck of a time figuring out why my changes to the settings file weren't going through until I realized I was being a dumbass and had been editing the default settings file in the program directory that only gets used to make the actual settings file during installation. If that's not the case, and the file gets rewritten every time you launch, then ya, I'd file a bug report.

About the add folder topic, I agree it's trivial if you're just doing a few mods, but I think most users have more than a few mods. And perhaps this is fine now, because most of us using OpenMW are a little more tech savvy than the average person, but once 1.0 launches and the project starts gaining a much larger user base, most people aren't gonna put up with editing text files themselves. I think we can agree one of the main reasons MGSO is so popular is it's so damn easy to install, and I think that is something we should aim to replicate.
not sure, since my information on where all the directories are for openmw is not complete. as in nobody seems to know or doesn't want to say. even though i ask. everything is top secret. yes i looked for other config file, and yes there is a default file, but it has very basic info in it and a header that says not to edit the file, so as far as i know, i am not editing the wrong file, unless there is another one in my documents (which linux doesnt like to do things that way but who knows). i dont have time to look right now but i will take it into consideration.

for the same reasons you mentioned having an "add folder" button would be necessary, i agree. once people start using the engine more and more, they will want ease of installation and not having to edit a config file. i dont mind it my self, and i would if someone would explain in detail the right way to do it step by step, but so far nobody will really explain it. not even the wiki does a good job of it. (unless it has changed since the last time i checked)

anyway, if it doesn't get done right now i dont really care, it just kind of makes me think less of the devs when they dont want to do something to really help someone understand what to do, or dont want to add a feature to the UI even though it would only make their project more popular. and forgive me if i am assuming that devs are answering questions for me, but that's just my guess, since usually those that answer get defensive like a mother who cant imagine her son doing anything wrong. "not my baby!" of course they could just be other users too but i kinda get the idea they cant handle constructive criticism or questions. if it rubs the wrong way i get it, but if i dont communicate my frustration or tell what is going on from my end then it would not be feedback.

with support and help, if people dont want to give help and support, they dont have to answer a question the wrong way, or answer as if someone already knows what they are talking about, and they dont have to keep pointing the finger at the user who is trying to sort things out. sometimes it is not user error that is to blame. sometimes it is bad communication, or a one way conversation attitude. yeah i understand it is a WIP, and there is limited staff, but i used to be a dev somewhere other than here, and it was even on a server, and i was more than happy to help someone or show them how to do something the right way to keep them from wasting more time on fixing problems than getting to enjoy the game. and it was in a much less mod friendly environment, on a total conversion mod. it really boils down to simple solutions to problems. if there is one, then it shouldn't be like pulling teeth from a chicken to get to the heart of the matter. if those who can fix the problem dont really listen, or if those that know how the user can fix it themselves dont really listen and offer a solution that works, then that just doesn't put any mod or game engine in a positive light. that's just how it goes. will i still play openmw? sure. things will smooth out over time i am sure once it gains momentum. but for now i guess there is an adjustment period where users and devs are going to bump heads for a while. it happens. i would jsut rather spend my weekends doing something i love or like than trying to play computer tech. that's no way to relax.

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psi29a
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by psi29a » 04 Feb 2016, 20:29

We do care, but we have other priorities like making sure OpenMW has feature parity with Morrowind. ;)

If you are bound and determined that it should be a feature, then create it in the bug tracker so it can be properly tracked and discussed. Just because it is talked about in the forums doesn't make it actionable. Only way to be sure is to file it as 'feature' over @ bugs.openmw.org

The other solution is to fix it yourself. That is the primary motivation behind developers, the personal itch that needs scratching. Not someone else's scratch. Welcome to open-source! :P

Antsan
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Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 11:15

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 04 Feb 2016, 23:26

I gave you step-by-step instructions and all you had to say that they were not sufficient. I cannot clarify without you specifying what is missing.

So, once again:

0) The Mod folder must satisfy a few conditions: Any ESPs must be in the toplevel of said folder. The same goes for folders which would normally go into the "Data Files" folder of Morrowind.

a) Open '~/.config/openmw/openmw.cfg' in your favourite text editor. Note how this is a file called 'openmw.cfg' in a folder called 'openmw'. It should exist already.
b) Start the plain (non-regex) search option of your editor. If you don't know what the "non-regex" means, just use the one you always use. Search for

Code: Select all

data=
Find the last entry that begins with this string. I don't know whether this is entirely correct, but when I say "entry" I mean "line".
c) Add a new entry below that last entry you just found. If your mod is in

Code: Select all

~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt/
then make the entry you just added to look like this:

Code: Select all

data="~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt"
Please note the quotes around the path name and that there is no trailing slash. I don't know whether a trailing slash would be a problem, but the original entry does not have one so I assume that this format works for sure.
d) Save and close the file.
e) Start the launcher.

The steps f) to i) are only necessary if the mod contains any ESPs that need to be activated.

f) Go to the "Data Files" tab.
g) Find the ESP that resides in the folder you just added to your openmw.cfg.

Steps h) and i) can be done in any order.

i) Drag the ESP to the correct position in the load order. ESPs are loaded from top to bottom in the displayed list.
j) Activate the checkbox to the left of the entry you just dragged into the correct position, so that there's a checkmark in the box.



Is this sufficient? Is still anything missing? If yes, I really do not have any idea what would be missing and you would need to tell me. Preferably with proper capitalization, sentence structure and paragraph structure.

xander2077
Posts: 46
Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 05 Feb 2016, 06:36

Antsan wrote:I gave you step-by-step instructions and all you had to say that they were not sufficient. I cannot clarify without you specifying what is missing.

So, once again:

0) The Mod folder must satisfy a few conditions: Any ESPs must be in the toplevel of said folder. The same goes for folders which would normally go into the "Data Files" folder of Morrowind.

a) Open '~/.config/openmw/openmw.cfg' in your favourite text editor. Note how this is a file called 'openmw.cfg' in a folder called 'openmw'. It should exist already.
b) Start the plain (non-regex) search option of your editor. If you don't know what the "non-regex" means, just use the one you always use. Search for

Code: Select all

data=
Find the last entry that begins with this string. I don't know whether this is entirely correct, but when I say "entry" I mean "line".
c) Add a new entry below that last entry you just found. If your mod is in

Code: Select all

~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt/
then make the entry you just added to look like this:

Code: Select all

data="~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt"
Please note the quotes around the path name and that there is no trailing slash. I don't know whether a trailing slash would be a problem, but the original entry does not have one so I assume that this format works for sure.
d) Save and close the file.
e) Start the launcher.

The steps f) to i) are only necessary if the mod contains any ESPs that need to be activated.

f) Go to the "Data Files" tab.
g) Find the ESP that resides in the folder you just added to your openmw.cfg.

Steps h) and i) can be done in any order.

i) Drag the ESP to the correct position in the load order. ESPs are loaded from top to bottom in the displayed list.
j) Activate the checkbox to the left of the entry you just dragged into the correct position, so that there's a checkmark in the box.



Is this sufficient? Is still anything missing? If yes, I really do not have any idea what would be missing and you would need to tell me. Preferably with proper capitalization, sentence structure and paragraph structure.
that is sufficient, and yes it was much clearer than the last time. and because it was clear, i realized the source of my problem. i was trying to load a folder without a esp. perhaps that is the reason why it did not work. now i know i can add a folder but it has to have an esp, still not sure why it was removing my folder that i put in the config file before, but it may be because it was not registering an esp? just a guess.

the reason i wanted to know is because i plan on adding mods to text compatibility and see if they interfere with other mods, and it would be better to use the openmw method than copy paste.

now that i know i can drag and drop items in the mod list in launcher (thanks to a couple of you) i can arrange the load order that way i guess.

Cramal
Posts: 186
Joined: 19 Sep 2014, 13:37

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Cramal » 05 Feb 2016, 06:51

@Anstan : your description of "how to add mods" is very clear and complete.

If you have the time, it would very usefull to create a wiki page with it so it does not get burried in old forum posts

Antsan
Posts: 44
Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 11:15

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 05 Feb 2016, 08:37

xander2077 wrote:
Antsan wrote:I gave you step-by-step instructions and all you had to say that they were not sufficient. I cannot clarify without you specifying what is missing.

So, once again:

0) The Mod folder must satisfy a few conditions: Any ESPs must be in the toplevel of said folder. The same goes for folders which would normally go into the "Data Files" folder of Morrowind.

a) Open '~/.config/openmw/openmw.cfg' in your favourite text editor. Note how this is a file called 'openmw.cfg' in a folder called 'openmw'. It should exist already.
b) Start the plain (non-regex) search option of your editor. If you don't know what the "non-regex" means, just use the one you always use. Search for

Code: Select all

data=
Find the last entry that begins with this string. I don't know whether this is entirely correct, but when I say "entry" I mean "line".
c) Add a new entry below that last entry you just found. If your mod is in

Code: Select all

~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt/
then make the entry you just added to look like this:

Code: Select all

data="~/MWMods/TamrielRebuilt"
Please note the quotes around the path name and that there is no trailing slash. I don't know whether a trailing slash would be a problem, but the original entry does not have one so I assume that this format works for sure.
d) Save and close the file.
e) Start the launcher.

The steps f) to i) are only necessary if the mod contains any ESPs that need to be activated.

f) Go to the "Data Files" tab.
g) Find the ESP that resides in the folder you just added to your openmw.cfg.

Steps h) and i) can be done in any order.

i) Drag the ESP to the correct position in the load order. ESPs are loaded from top to bottom in the displayed list.
j) Activate the checkbox to the left of the entry you just dragged into the correct position, so that there's a checkmark in the box.



Is this sufficient? Is still anything missing? If yes, I really do not have any idea what would be missing and you would need to tell me. Preferably with proper capitalization, sentence structure and paragraph structure.
that is sufficient, and yes it was much clearer than the last time. and because it was clear, i realized the source of my problem. i was trying to load a folder without a esp. perhaps that is the reason why it did not work. now i know i can add a folder but it has to have an esp, still not sure why it was removing my folder that i put in the config file before, but it may be because it was not registering an esp? just a guess.

the reason i wanted to know is because i plan on adding mods to text compatibility and see if they interfere with other mods, and it would be better to use the openmw method than copy paste.

now that i know i can drag and drop items in the mod list in launcher (thanks to a couple of you) i can arrange the load order that way i guess.
Not clear enough, it seems. The mod folder does not need to contain an ESP, it just won't find any ESPs elsewhere.
Cramal wrote:@Anstan : your description of "how to add mods" is very clear and complete.

If you have the time, it would very usefull to create a wiki page with it so it does not get burried in old forum posts
Do You know who I habe to ask for access to the Wiki?

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psi29a
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by psi29a » 05 Feb 2016, 09:37

Go to your UCP here in the forums and add yourself to the wiki group. ;)

Antsan
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 05 Feb 2016, 16:32

Oh, good. :oops:

Antsan
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 07 Feb 2016, 13:53

I added the instructions to the Mod Installation page. It would be nice if
1. someone who doesn't know how to install mods
2. someone who knows how OpenMW does mod loading
would check what I added for correctness and whether the instructions are clear and followable.

xander2077
Posts: 46
Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 07 Feb 2016, 20:23

only thing i would suggest is someone (maybe not you) add the similar instructions for mac and windows users. otherwise it looks good.

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