Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

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xander2077
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Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 23 Jan 2016, 17:50

I currently run under linux, so getting the load order to behave, or even trying to point the launcher to an extra directory has been a headache, so i was forced to use wyremash to edit dates of file creation just to get the load order corrected.

here is my idea to help bypass that. instead of using the same rule as morrowind does, and relying on the date of creation to determine the load order for ALL mods (except the main archives, morrowind, bloodmoon, and tribunal) it seems like it would be less of a hassle to eliminate that requirement for all the other mods. instead it would open a lot of possibilities for load order. the one i would like to see implemented, is the ability to click on the entry in the list, and once that is done, up and down arrows would become available to enable moving the entry up or down, which would reflect in the config file once a button was clicked to save the desired order. and then a rule that would tell the engine to load those mods according to how they are listed in the config file. there should also be a separate set of rules for the main three archive files in the launcher code so they cannot be moved, just the mods should be movable up or down in the load order.

the reason i think this is a good idea is because it has been a headache trying to get manual editing in the config file or extra directories to work in openmw under linux. enabling this kind of feature in the launcher would probably help a lot of people using linux, and i could see the benefit of having this feature in windows and mac as well. plus it would eliminate a lot of clutter in the forums (which is already cluttered)

i also think that when people figure out how to make things work that their fix (the big ones anyway that effect a lot of people) should linked in the wiki so people don't have to come in the forum to try and get support for every little thing. or at the very least they can find a pinned solution in a separate tutorial forum section, where problems solved, or tutorials are organized according to OS. there is a bleed-over between community growth and bad communication. the bad communication is certainly causing more people to flock here, but for all the wrong reasons, mostly because they are disappointed or frustrated and just want something to work. not because they are happy with the engine. granted it works great when it works, but i would rather see people come here for fun that out of duress.

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Okulo
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Joined: 05 Feb 2012, 16:11

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Okulo » 30 Jan 2016, 12:35

xander2077 wrote:even trying to point the launcher to an extra directory has been a headache
Just adding a line to a config file is hardly a headache.
xander2077 wrote:the ability to click on the entry in the list, and once that is done, up and down arrows would become available to enable moving the entry up or down
You can just drag and drop what's there already.

All I can think of to make this easier is an "add folder" button to the launcher so you don't have to add the line to the config file manually.

Antsan
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Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 11:15

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 31 Jan 2016, 02:19

An "Add folder" button really would be nice.

Drag'n'drop can be a PITA. Scrolling doesn't work nicely while dragging (unless a mouse wheel is available, I guess), the positioning in the list after dropping isn't as expected intuitively when moving stuff downwards in the list, as everything which was below the moved entries moves up, which can be jarring because I expect my cursor to end up at the top of the moved entries.
I propose these buttons: "Move to end", "Move to beginning", "Move after master files", "Move down", "Move up".

Another thing: ESPs are listed in reverse order in relation to their folders' order in the config. That is, if there's foo.esp in ~/mwmods/foo/ and bar.esp in ~/mwmods/bar/ and the entries in the config are like this:

Code: Select all

data="~/mwmods/foo"
data="~/mwmods/bar"
Then bar.esp will be listed before foo.esp in the launcher, which necessitates reordering almost always – because, if I put the folders in a certain order that is probably because the contents should be loaded in that order.

xander2077
Posts: 46
Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 01 Feb 2016, 00:05

Okulo wrote:
xander2077 wrote:even trying to point the launcher to an extra directory has been a headache
Just adding a line to a config file is hardly a headache.
xander2077 wrote:the ability to click on the entry in the list, and once that is done, up and down arrows would become available to enable moving the entry up or down
You can just drag and drop what's there already.

All I can think of to make this easier is an "add folder" button to the launcher so you don't have to add the line to the config file manually.
it is a headache when you try multiple times and it wont stay in the config file.

i was not aware of the drag and drop capability in the mod list window, if that changes the load order then great, that was what i was looking for, if not then whats the point? still buttons would be nice to make sure things move as Antsan said, DnD is a pita sometimes.

i agree an "add folder" button would be nice and it would take the guess work out of trying to put the correct syntax into the config file, plus launcher rewrites that file because it is designed to, and it would eliminate the problem i am having where i write entries for extra directories and they get erased when i open the launcher.

Antsan
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Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 11:15

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 01 Feb 2016, 00:13

xander2077 wrote: it is a headache when you try multiple times and it wont stay in the config file.
This sounds more like a bug than missing functionality. I never had that problem.
i was not aware of the drag and drop capability in the mod list window, if that changes the load order then great, that was what i was looking for, if not then whats the point? still buttons would be nice to make sure things move as Antsan said, DnD is a pita sometimes.

i agree an "add folder" button would be nice and it would take the guess work out of trying to put the correct syntax into the config file, plus launcher rewrites that file because it is designed to, and it would eliminate the problem i am having where i write entries for extra directories and they get erased when i open the launcher.
As far as I can tell the launcher does not have a special config file telling it which entries it has, it reads this information from openmw.cfg
So it would be kind of strange if it knew which of these entries were added by itself and which were added by the user at startup. If it deletes the entries you made, it will also delete the entries it itself added.

I'm only guessing, of course. I don't know the source code and it might do something I don't expect at all (and it already does, obviously, otherwise there wouldn't be such a strange bug). Still, launcher features are not what is causing these entries to go missing. That shouldn't happen in the first place.

xander2077
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Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 01 Feb 2016, 12:38

im just guessing as well, but my point was added functionality would probably be the fix for my particular issue, since i dont know how to debug the issue, and the log doesn't say anything to indicate what is going on when it happens, i dont know where to go from there. im just guessing because my entries are disappearing when i open the launcher. when i type them in they are there and saved before i run the launcher, and then gone after i run the launcher and open the config file. so between writing them and launching the launcher, something is going on.

Antsan
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Joined: 13 Mar 2014, 11:15

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Antsan » 01 Feb 2016, 13:23

To the topic itself: It would be nice if there was a warning if a folder pointed to by a `data=` entry was missing. I noticed that I mistyped such an entry because I saw the ESP in that folder missing and checked, but with mods only changing textures and such this would have gone unnoticed for much longer.

xander2077
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Joined: 20 Jan 2016, 08:20

Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by xander2077 » 02 Feb 2016, 03:00

and that is why an add folder button would be great because you can point it to the existing folder. as long as the structure is correct it should work. anything can go wrong when you are forced to type the entry in the config file.

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Okulo
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Okulo » 02 Feb 2016, 20:42

An "add folder" button would do little to solve that, since you could easily move around or rename the folder afterwards, which means you'd still be managing your folders manually. Besides, if you're a semi-intelligent user, you have been copypasting the lines into the config file from the file manager anyway instead of typing the entry out. The way to solve this what Antsan said: add a check as the config file is read.

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Ravenwing
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Re: Idea for openmw launcher load order functionality

Post by Ravenwing » 03 Feb 2016, 03:22

@xander2077 I'm not at my desktop where I have everything installed so I can't be sure, but is there a separate config file located in your user documents? (I'm guessing it's similar on linux) I had a heck of a time figuring out why my changes to the settings file weren't going through until I realized I was being a dumbass and had been editing the default settings file in the program directory that only gets used to make the actual settings file during installation. If that's not the case, and the file gets rewritten every time you launch, then ya, I'd file a bug report.

About the add folder topic, I agree it's trivial if you're just doing a few mods, but I think most users have more than a few mods. And perhaps this is fine now, because most of us using OpenMW are a little more tech savvy than the average person, but once 1.0 launches and the project starts gaining a much larger user base, most people aren't gonna put up with editing text files themselves. I think we can agree one of the main reasons MGSO is so popular is it's so damn easy to install, and I think that is something we should aim to replicate.

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