Characters and physics

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TheOneWhoWatches
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Characters and physics

Post by TheOneWhoWatches » 16 Apr 2014, 05:06

I've read OpenMW wishlist and noticed this:
Animations
new slots for animations
sit down
sit a horse (or guar)
emotes or something approximating them (wave, bow, smile, etc.)
lie down
wobble bone(s) as used in Oblivion for the jiggle effect in the female's chest, etc...
Ability to play Animation on the PC
Smoothed animation transitions
Alternative melle/ranged attack animations, ex: X swing.
So I wanted to note that there's a better alternative to this (If I'm not mistaken), It's called hdtPhysicsExtensions. It's a plugin for Skyrim Scripting Extended.

Samples:
http://gamer-mods.ru/_ld/18/78159719.jpg
Hair and cloth test on youtube

It gained popularity as a plugin for realistic(or not, depending on settings) breast jiggle (and it can properly "collide" with armor if I'm not mistaken), but as I see, there are hairs and clothes, butt, belly, tails, ears, earrings (and muscle-like behaviour?)

As I understand, here are source files of hdtPhysicsExtensions

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cc9cii
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by cc9cii » 16 Apr 2014, 10:21

Looks to be using havok. Not possible to use directly with opennmw's physics (bullet). Also unclear what kind of license?

Our current physics is not even at the level of vanilla morrowind, so achieving similar things to what's shown on the video will take a lot of effort and time I think.

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bahamut
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by bahamut » 16 Apr 2014, 11:53

iirc hdtPhysicsExtensions is not really a plugin but a kinda hack to make Skyrims havok more usefull, in Dawnguard DLC Harkon (in vampire lord form) had a havok'ed cape, this plugin made possible to use same effect on other character parts

MacKom
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Joined: 26 Mar 2013, 13:00

Re: Characters and physics

Post by MacKom » 16 Apr 2014, 12:12

hdt plugin has been know to cause CTDs in Skyrim (I had it too) due to overwriting original skeleton settings, so you had to re-install your body replacer. Not to mention conflicts between body phisycs (jiggle bewbs) and say, hair.

Also, can I please request NO JIGGLY MEGA BOOBS in Morrowind, EVER? The game deserves so much more than becoming another waifu simulator (just look at Oblivion and Skyrim...) :?

TheOneWhoWatches
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by TheOneWhoWatches » 16 Apr 2014, 16:11

@cc9cii
I see. Just wanted to show you something that's more interesting and have more purposes than quoted text from the wishlist. I'm not a programmer and I have no idea about bullet's possible application but I thought you'll have any use of that and just to voice this idea.

@bahamut
Well, this is SKSE plugin, so I said that. :)

@MacKom
OffTopic:
Many advanced plugins cause CTDs. It's only natural, but they have guides and how-tos to ensure proper setup and avoid problems. I had CTDs but they all happened because I did something wrong while installing mods so I'm the one to blame.
Err... As I said in another topic, it's possible to mod MEGA BOOBS in Morrowind even now so I can't understand what you're trying to say.
It's strange to try to limit modding potential...
Modders are doing what they want and it's a bad idea to try to control them. If someone wants to create body mod, he will try to do it anyway, the only difference is that it will be limited. Or he won't create it at all.
I didn't think of Skyrim as "waifu simulator", although I saw most of the body mods with breasts starting at a-cup and up to something ridiculous, pregnant and etc. But as I was often told "don't want it, don't use it", so I just didn't use what I didn't like.
Regrettably, I didn't like Oblivion (completed many quest being level 1 and got demotivated) and Skyrim (it looked too "generic" for me).
I thought that multitude of body mods is a disadvantage for Skyrim (especially for armor/clothing mods), but some time later main ones were CBBE and UNPB and UNPB is winning (I might be wrong though). It took some time though unlike Morrowind (there were many body mods, but Better Bodies were the best one without any doubt), but there are many other mods. Well, since I don't like Skyrim that much, I can't think what interesting mods are out there. I remember bigger trees, dense vegetation, flora overhaul, over 9000 animation mods, supreme and volumetric fog,lanterns of skyrim, etc etc...
IMHO body sliders can help limit body mods count, but for Skyrim sliders only existed as an external application if I'm not mistaken.
tl;dr Limiting modding capabilities isn't a good idea. Modders will do what they want anyway.

P.S. Excuse me for my English.

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bahamut
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by bahamut » 16 Apr 2014, 18:34

MacKom wrote: Also, can I please request NO JIGGLY MEGA BOOBS in Morrowind, EVER? The game deserves so much more than becoming another waifu simulator (just look at Oblivion and Skyrim...) :?
Yea, when i found about the extension "cool mabye theye are some nice robes/capes now", what i only found where couple of hair mods and vast splendora of bouncing butts and boobs,

@TheOneWhoWatches
i dont think that i said it clearly but, this "extension" do not implement any kind of phyics engine on its own, but uses already ingame phycisc engine, expanding on what stuff physics can be applied

TheOneWhoWatches
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Joined: 08 Apr 2014, 07:06
Location: Russia/Siberia

Re: Characters and physics

Post by TheOneWhoWatches » 17 Apr 2014, 03:12

bahamut wrote:
MacKom wrote: Also, can I please request NO JIGGLY MEGA BOOBS in Morrowind, EVER? The game deserves so much more than becoming another waifu simulator (just look at Oblivion and Skyrim...) :?
Yea, when i found about the extension "cool mabye theye are some nice robes/capes now", what i only found where couple of hair mods and vast splendora of bouncing butts and boobs,

@TheOneWhoWatches
i dont think that i said it clearly but, this "extension" do not implement any kind of phyics engine on its own, but uses already ingame phycisc engine, expanding on what stuff physics can be applied
Indeed, there are no additional physics engine in there.

As for using hdtPhysicsExtensions, there are capes/robes for it. I saw them yesterday. Keep in mind that this extension is relatively new and was "evolving" and changing for some time. Bouncing breasts in Skyrim existed for a very long time and body mods that supported breast bounce didn't require additional tweaks and can be used with hdtPhysicsExtensions "as is" is i'm not mistaken while clothing and hair mod should be rigged differently (and not every modder know of this mod).

Chris
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by Chris » 17 Apr 2014, 03:36

With regards to physics extensions, since Oblivion and Skyrim use Havok, those custom NIF nodes will contain Havok data. Theoretically, if we can parse the node data and convert it to something Bullet can use, OpenMW can use them. However, our physics engine is in no shape to do any of this currently, and there would need to be exporters that can put those node types into Morrowind-version NIFs.

In regards to turning Morrowind into a 'waifu simulator', I already feel the various head, hair, and body mesh and texture mods unnecessarily prettify the races. The only reason Morrowind doesn't have it as bad is because the game is old, has less fidelity, and the focus now is on newer games.

TheOneWhoWatches
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Joined: 08 Apr 2014, 07:06
Location: Russia/Siberia

Re: Characters and physics

Post by TheOneWhoWatches » 17 Apr 2014, 04:03

To be honest I just wanted to show everyone a concept that doesn't only fit breast jiggle, but applicable to many things. It may not be possible for a long time and changed drastically but here we can see many examples of what's possible.

Well, sometimes a simple chain of bones with collision boxes can be enough for a hair or a dress or something else...

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Mistahtokyo
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Re: Characters and physics

Post by Mistahtokyo » 17 Apr 2014, 06:09

I wouldn't mind something like this for hair, capes, robes, skirts, long dresses, etc. There's a lot of potential. If someone wants to make uber bouncing boobs, it's none of our business. The point of an open source project afaik is to expand upon creativity/freedom, not stifle it. Of course, this probably won't be high in the priority list compared to other features/issues and it may just be to difficult to work into OpenMW, but at least don't reject it because someone could possibly use it in a way you don't like.

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